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Laurie loaded .308 Win ammo* with 16 LR primer varieties and then tested for average velocity, ES/SD, and group size. %%EOF Standard deviation . Doesn't appear to work. LP = Large Pistol . Add to Wishlist. and brass. It was topped with a Leupold 6.5-20X scope in Leupold Originally designed for the bolt-action Mosin-Nagant rifle, it was used during the late tsarist era and throughout the Soviet period to the present day. I can tell you CCI BR2's give a little less velocity and better SD numbers than Federal 210M which gave a little less velocity and better SD numbers than Remington 9 1/2 with the same powder and cartridge. and .280 Rem., to name a few. 0000006474 00000 n 0000027640 00000 n It does show there are great differences in primers RIfle Primers Brand/type_____Power Average___Range____Std. Listed From Fastest to Slowest: 1 NORMA R1 36 Winchester WSF. CCI 34 - 7.62mm Large Rifle Primers Box of 1 000 Limit 5 per customer. Federal Champion No. Leupold LPS 3.5-14X scope in Sako mounts on it. The Wolf Small rifle with the copper cup I've had failure to fire with my light striking bolt guns, but they go bang every time in my ar15. So what's the difference? Copyright 2000-2023 24hourcampfire.com, Inc. All Rights Reserved. In bolt action rifles, not semis. Yeah yeah yeah, and matchkings won't kill a deer. 0000000016 00000 n One new winner* is announced every week! Primer Testing Reference. see how these components would perform under the conditions stated here. Check With Your Local Ammo. Within every Remington primer is a group of subcomponents assembled to exceptionally tight tolerances. $8.09. 0000005537 00000 n 1.09K Views. once fired Weatherby brass and the Sierra 190-grain Match King bullet, molly the 3 frozen overnight. . Many shooters wrongly believe that BR or magnum models have thicker brass and are therefore 'tougher' than standard . Most important thing to find out is. Match event calendar and rifle competition accuracy training tips. .2232, 16 CCI 300 LP 3.18 Thanks again for the excellent write-up and work! 300 | 1,000 Count $ 42.99. A larger sweet spot means more reliable ignition in guns that produce off-center hits. You are using an out of date browser. It stands to reason that such cusp cartridges, as I like to call them, would have . Many handloaders think the 215 is still the hottest commercial rifle primer, but the CCI and Winchester magnum rifle primers are just as hot, if not a little hotter. Large Rifle Primer Performance by Laurie Holland You must log in or register to reply here. Match King bullet, molly coated. I cannot Read more; CCI Aps BR4 Small Rifle Benchrest (1000) $ 135.00. 30H32. Air Rifle Accessories Air Rifle Bags Air Rifle Magazines Air Rifle Pellets Air Rifle Targets Air Rifles Co2 Air Rifles Hunting Air Rifles PCP Air Rifles Package Deals Target & Youth Air Rifles; Airsoft. This may be the most comprehensive and thorough LR primer test ever done. Remington AmmunitionRemington Large Rifle Magnum Primers #9-1/2M Box of 1000. This is interesting, according to this, Federal Gold Metal MatchKing 308 ammo should not be shot in a AR10 or 308 platform. 0000001395 00000 n Federal Large Rifle Magnum #215M Gold Medal Match Primers | 1,000 Count. Dev, 1 Fed Match GM215M 6.12 5.23-6.8 .351, 2 Federal 215 LRM 5.69 %PDF-1.4 % Another unexpected finding was that with all of the 17-round strings halted for 15 or more minutes for barrel cooling between shots 10 and 11, in over half of the strings shot 11 produced a (low) MV that was out of the range of the others and had to be discounted. TYPE OF PRIMER USED FOR PCS PER GRATING GRATINGS PER BOX BOXES PER CASE WEIGHT PER CASE; kg lb; V360157: Small Pistol 4,4 Boxer: . 0000002349 00000 n 100%. Trying to decide which primers to buy next. Between these two extremes are Large Rifle primers of almost any brisance level. In early black powder guns such as muzzleloaders, the primer was essentially the same chemical as the main propellant (albeit usually in a finer-powdered form), but poured into an external flash . According to the same Internet sources, the Federal Gold Match Large Rifle Magnum primers (215M) are at the top of the list in terms of heat. Primers, the Sparkplug of Centerfire Cartridges - CHUCKHAWKS.COM Reloaders know that primers come in various designations: large pistol vs small pistol, large rifle vs small rifle, etc. This is on a DMS (don't mean squat) scale. a custom Remington 700 we have built ourselves. It was also years ago and things may have changed. So my question is whether you would expect to see a very similar trend among the primers you tested with other cartridges and/or bullet weights commonly used in F-TR or F-Open? Primer with Smallest Group Size: Remington 9 LR (0.43 average, three 5-shot groups) 0000003606 00000 n http://www.prfelr0.f2s.com/prfelr0/primers1.jpg, http://www.prfelr0.f2s.com/prfelr0/primers2.jpg. 0000027388 00000 n Reloading Primers | Sportsman's Warehouse RWS, CCI BR2, Federal 210M, Federal 210, This is likely a matter of conjecture. July 21, 2020 By Joseph von Benedikt. in red which was frozen over night and then shot. Found this from offsite search, exactly the information I need. Click Photo to read full test results in Target Shooter Magazine. Are Wolf Primers still consistent? Ultimate Large Rifle Primer Shoot-Out 16 Types Tested Very good read. It will still fire, but they get fliers and open groups. Lee Reloading Auto-Prime Hand Priming Tool. CCI #250 Large Rifle Magnum Primers (1000) Rated 5.00 out of 5 $ 95.00. Great info. Federal - 209A. is a double base powder, same bullet and brass. A different order between a few wouldn't surprise me in the least - especially if I did it all again with a different standard load. The pressure changed dramatically sometimes (8k-13k PSI). It's higher than 30-30, and not much less than the 30-06. Note the spreads. Ammo Primers - Rifle, Shotgun & Pistol Primers - Winchester ga.src = ('https:' == document.location.protocol ? Dev . The generally accepted difference is heat is 6 percent, up and down from the middle ground CCI200, although that is subject to actual scientific data, which I . The only thing they changed was the primer. Check With Your Local Ammo. The first "magnum" primer, the Federal 215 was designed for this very purpose. Thank you, [#11] 5 Alliant e3 40 Ramshot True Blue. I have to wonder if the lack of hard data comes from the manufacturers not wanting to be held to some yahoo's feeble attempts to "prove they cheated me" with craptasticly bad "testing." 2854 0 obj <>stream Primer Substitutions - Sierra Bullets Reading primers tells you a lot about how hard the primer cups are, what your headspace is like, how big your firing pin hole is, and how sharp your firing pin is, but it doesn't tell much about peak pressure. Reloading Ammo: Cartridge Primers and Pressure Differences Reply. They are very similar in their rate of propagation. Primer "heat" across various brands of primers?? - Smith And Wesson Forums The brass colored wolf primers always fire fine in my bolt guns (and in my ar15 as well). The Primer - Sierra Bullets Primer brisance. | Sniper's Hide Forum Three shot CCI 250 MAG Large Rifle Primers - 100 Ct. $9.49. CCI No. work up a load from a safe, published starting load. Keep to the lower end of reloading recommendations. $5.19. As an aside, a couple of years ago, shortmags.org published a list of primers from hottest to coolest. His subsequent usage of Winchester Large Rifle standard lit all his powder. I noticed they listed James Calhoon in that article. for the 300 Weatherby magnum. A final part of the test took a small number of the best performers and ran them in my primary 155.5gn Berger BT Fullbore / IMR-8208 XBR load without the MagnetoSpeed on to see what they did to groups without a load-retune against my usual CCI-BR4 load and to see if they would cope OK with 60,000 psi pressure. This is more visual and tells a good story too. I took four large pistol primers (CCI 300's), four large rifle primers (CCI 200's) and four large rifle bench rest primers (CCI BR-2's) and measured the width and depth of all three primer types. I have Federal 210 primers(only 30 or so) but my local store also has Fed 210M primers. Large Rifle = LR, Large Rifle Magnum = LRM, Large pistol =LP, Brand/type Power Average Range Std. Fiocchi Large Rifle Primers. Add to Wishlist. http://www.sksboards.com/smf/index.php?topic=56422.0, http://www.mpzflame.ru/production/primers/, www.sinclairintl.com/product/11248/Primer-Pocket-Tools, https://www.rcbs.com/priming/bench-mounted/automatic-priming-tool/16-9460.html, The Snobbiest Town in The Snobbiest State in the N, Fiocchi, Ginex, Murow Small Rifle Primers, Experience 223 Remington. LR Primer Types Tested for Velocity, ES/SD, Group Size and More! But if you cant spare the time right now, here are some highlights below: Primer with Lowest Velocity: Remington 9 M Magnum (2780 fps) I'm am not doing this again! Seating the Large Rifle primers in a standard Large Pistol pocket may cause high primers . Large Rifle Primers; Shotshell Primers; Best Selling In PRIMERS. Primers - Sellier & Bellot This is a retype after losing the original web page. Bullets; Primers; . coated. 4 Comments. All 3 round with the RWS primer had hang fired. Benchrest Primers vs Standard | Long Range Hunting Forum The 7.6254mmR is a rimmed rifle cartridge developed by the Russian Empire and introduced as a service cartridge in 1891. Winchester works to make sure all primers are reliable, instant and precise. Most Accurate Rifle Primers for Precision Reloading We thought of trying 3 different powders in each case groups. Reloading Primers - Reloading Unlimited 50 BMG (BMG) CCI - No.35. hbbd```b``:"gI~ 2.l#0qd f$3|{ 4 $7.30. bullet and brass. 0000004308 00000 n Primer dimensions - Gunloads.com Copyright 1996-2023 AR15.COM LLC. Interesting that the CCI BR2 was running hotter than the CCI 200. On the 6mm BR forum a guy took a bunch of photos of different primers and measured the flame against a ruler to determine the aggressive rating of the primer. average of all the 4 groups above it. The biggest surprise to me came from an elderly (at least 10 years) lot of Czech Sellier & Bellot standard caps with an ES of 12 and SD of 3.1 fps, way below those of the nearest competitor. Three shot groups. 4 Accurate Arms Nitro 100 39 IMR, Co SR 4756. firing 15 Nosler 130-gr. We used Lapua brass and the 5.2-6.5 .4437, 3 CCI 250 LRM 5.66 Thank you very much for your efforts in providing this excellent article. startxref Primer Testing Reference - castingstuff.com It has no pistol primers, but if you look at the difference between the Remington 6 1/2 and 7 1/2, that's pretty typical of the difference between a standard rifle and a magnum rifle primer, though the material the 6 1/2 is stamped from is softer than the CCI of the same thickness and is known to leak gas if it is used in the .223. PRIMER LEGEND . And standard both Magnum. to the 30-06. #34 and #41 are military primer designations for large and small rifle primers, respectively. Their magnum LR primer is the F215. Federal Champion Centerfire Small Rifle Primer - 100 Ct. No media assets available for preview. CCI Aps BR2 Large Rifle Benchrest (1000) $ 135.00. - Cases that utilize small rifle primers and operate at higher pressures (55,000 psi) should use CCI 450, CCI BR4, Fed 205 and Rem 7 1/2. The standard pocket for a Large Pistol primer is somewhat shallower than its Large Rifle counterpart, specifically, 0.008 to 0.009 inch less. Depending on your needs and expectations, they may be worth the extra cost. The pointer remains at the highest point of the shot. CCI Bench Rest Large Rifle Primers 1000/Box $199.99; Notify Me When Available; Brand: CCI; Item Number: 10 BK; CCI Large Rifle Primers 1000/Box $149.99; Notify Me When Available; . These primers are designed for everything from small-caliber rifles and handguns to the large-caliber rifles . WSL. effects on this. Five round with the RWS primers hang fired, including 2 of What is the pressure of a .44mag? Buy in store-Limit 2. $7.99. Large rifle primers all come with one brass thickness, a nominal 0.027" (unlike small rifle primers which vary from 0.020" to 0.025" depending on make/type). 6,5 to 9,3 mm. There really is no such chart. Every serious hand-loader should definitely read the full test results to understand Lauries methodology and get all the details. I am currently shooting CCI BR2 primers in my .25-06, but feel like I may not be shooting a hot enough primer. Ranked in order of power. bullet, 55 grains of Reloader 19, in Winchester brass. way up the neck. It was such a tedious task that I abandoned my original plan of also doing pistol primers. PDF Primer Size Chart - Henry Krank Lyman & Nosler classify this as a standard primer, but Hornady, Handloads.com, and Chuck Hawks classify it as a small rifle magnum primer. That said, I had heard the CCI 450's and #41's were basically the same so I was searching for differences and found these post's. Three shot groups. 3.8-4.8 .3218, 12 KVB 7 LR Russian 4.27 3.8-4.8 .2213, 13 Rem 91/2 (30 yrs old) 4.16 3.8-4.8 .3427, 14 Rem LP 4.47 0000053767 00000 n It takes a Large Rifle Magnum primer to reliably light this much powder. It is relative to this set of tests and this tester. Shop Primers And More | Remington www.TargetSportsUSA.com - PRIMERS Your first post mentioned measuring the depth of the primers, and to my way of looking at the world, that . RockyRaab, the only difference between their list and yours is that they list CCI BR4 and CCI 400 as hotter than FED 200. And get this, among ALL the primers tested, Rem 9M Magnum primers produced the lowest velocity, while Rem 9 LR (non-magnum) primers yielded the highest velocity. Even though they dont recommend it? 100. were very even, but this was a limited lot and they are not widely available. Does anyone have any information regarding the characteristics of S & B primers and how they compare to the other primer brands described above? Seems they give me good results across the board. Heat of explosion per gram is similar as well. This extensive test is an important contribution to the knowledge base of precision shooting. Remington says the compound is the same as the 6, but with a thicker cup. That is how I came up with the results. Federal Small Rifle Primers (Champion) 1000/Box $219.99; Notify Me When Available; Brand: Federal; Item Number: 205 BK; Large rifle primers all appear to have the same cup thickness, no matter what the type. Store For Availability. This primer can be used in place of the SRM primer or used when a different powder is used that is hard to ignite." Large Rifle Standard Credit should also be given to Target Shooter Magazine for publishing the results. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. LR Primer Types Tested for Velocity, ES/SD, Group Size and More! grains in, or a variety of combinations). Handloader Magazine does it every once in a while. Dev. shoot them as a group, noting both the velocity and the accuracy, and compare When pkts start getting loose, switch to them and get couple extra firings. Match event calendar and rifle competition accuracy training tips. The Test. 0000007461 00000 n We thought of doing the test on 4 different case sizes. Out of stock. This may be the most comprehensive and thorough LR primer test ever done. . This keeps grains of powder out of the flash hole. Fishing Bait Chart; Hunting Camo Patterns; Guns. Three shot groups. The LRP is at least .008 taller than the LPP and has a significantly thicker cup (not shown on chart). FWIW, Dutch. 0000015415 00000 n the frozen ones. As Slamfire said, the #34 and #41 military hard primers likely will be more constant. 1 of the frozen BR2 rounds hag fired. We know that major seating faults definitely have an effect, but do minor variations in seating tension too? Firing pin strength also seems to be a definite factor. Out of stock. PRODUCT No: TYPE OF PRIMER USED FOR PCS PER BOX Does anyone have or know of a chart that lists primers from the hottest to the lightest? 2 Winchester WAALite 37 VihtaVuori N340. The first bit of useful trivia is that even though Small Rifle and Small Pistol primer pockets share the same depth specification, Large Rifle and Large Pistol primers do not. I have never looked at primers apart from reliability. . At .020' thick cup metal, these primers are minimal, at best, for light .223 Remington loads. PDF Primer Cross Reference Chart - Graf & S Primers are tested for reliability from -20 degrees F to +150 degrees F. _gaq.push(['_trackPageview']); Product Details. I only remember that there wasn't a heckuva lot of difference in any of them, until you start comparing one end of the list against the opposite. Between these two extremes are Large Rifle primers of almost any brisance level. How To Use A Burn-Rate Chart - Shooting Times 22661. Primer burn rate(?) chart - AR15.COM I used the CCI large pistol magnums primers, and they performed just like rifle primers, they didn't peirce, or flatten, ignited the rifle powder just fine. NOTE: This data is reference only. I think all of the flame pictures help illustrate that the variety of primer models do different stuff despite all primers being divided into just a few categories. For this test, I used previously necked up and fireformed Norma 22-250 brass, body sized with a custom Redding . Primer with Biggest Group Size: CBC Magtech 9 (0.7 average, three 5-shot groups). We used I suspect they have a minor influence, but thats hunch not science! It is obvious that the thicker cups will withstand more pressure. GM205M. Brisance (?) values for primers like burn rates for powders? - Gunloads.com It's higher than 30-30, and not much less than the 30-06. NRA Member..SWCA Member..Semi-Retired, But Not Dead Yet. J E CUSTOM . This is the home made tester. 0000054368 00000 n Reloading Primers - Hunting at Fleet Farm Remington Large Rifle Primers #9-1/2 Box of 1000 (10 Trays of 100) I would like to state This testing was done to try and rank primers by power (brisance). The following are the results of a 308 Winchester, shot in It is ever so slightly hotter than the small rifle magnum primer and it comes with a brass colored thick cup. A F215 in a .338 Win Mag load. different case sizes. A write-up will be done soon. If you are shooting a 22 Cooper, Hornet, or a Bee, the .020" cup will perform admirably. <<917A3329DAD4B341BF9A2FBBF1E535ED>]/Prev 194532/XRefStm 1395>> $7.99. Ballistic Tips paired with 58.0 grs. 0000054449 00000 n Primer Size Chart . endstream endobj startxref So, don't take this as gospel but as a rough indicator. All cases for each group For this we would leave some loaded rounds in the freezer, and JavaScript is disabled. This is where the similarity ends. All Rights Reserved. Primer Flash Test Photos Non-corrosive, all weather primers deliver fast, dependable ignition under any shooting condition. Large rifle primers - which measure about .128 inches in height and .212 inches in width. brass. NOTE: Values in chart are based on 15-Shot strings. And standard primers. trailer 0000015264 00000 n CCI 300 STD Large Rifle Primers - 100 Ct. No media assets available for preview. Are there any primer hotness charts here? The first "magnum" primer, the Federal 215 was designed for this very purpose. CCI No. There are a great many views on the subject, a few based on tests (including primer flame photography) but most apparently hearsay. Laurie Holland. SR = Small Rifle . My Components; My Loading Data; All User Loading Data; Components . Three shot groups. The following loads were with 48 grains of VVN 550 powder, 2829 0 obj <> endobj Since these were readily available, I chose these two primers for use in this test. Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. LPM = Large Pistol Mag . Most basic there are large rifle primers. Smyth Busters: Can You Interchange Rifle & Pistol Primers? Or if they are so constantly tweaking their formulas and mixes that the information we're looking for is too much of a moving target. CCI primers offer the reloader clean, reliable ignition. The barrel was 24 inches long. Primer Testing Reference You will see a large difference if you go from a large rifle primer to a magnum primer so look at primer Brisance. #4. Thats counter-intuitive and its odd that Rems were at opposite ends of the speed spectrum among ALL primers tested. www.6mmbr.com. :u0RFH1r)F#a9nZh. Warning: Some published data calls for Large Rifle primers, though this brass was designed for, and most data is for Large Pistol primers. 506 42 Reloading Rifle Primers - Reloading Unlimited hb``Pc`` From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm. Some of Lauries results may surprise you. That article featured actual pressures changes in identical charge weights using Lake City Match brass, Sierra 168 grain Match Kings and 40.5 grains of IMR-4895. Large- or Small-Rifle Primers: Which is Better? | An Official Journal Read more. In the recent past I had been using BR-4's but have found the extra flash from #41's to give me slightly better groups at 1k. Freedom Is Never Free. Of the others, there WAS a relation between weight and power. Match-Grade Rifle Primers: Are They Better and Worth the - RifleShooter What Are the Four Primer Sizes? | Powder Valley The main question that remains for me is how the primers results might vary between different cartridges, bullet weights, and powder loads. Testing 16 primer types was a huge task we commend Laurie for his hard work and thoroughness. Remington HTP .38 SPC 110-Grain Ammunition - 50 Rounds . of extruded Hodgdon H4831. Large Rifle Primer brisance chart | Nosler Reloading Forum These include the 308, 25-06 Remington, 300 Weatherby magnum, and finally the Dont know why they tested 210M primers as they seem to have gone the way of the passenger pigeon. Primer comparisons | Ruger Forum 4.5-7.4 .4832, 4Winchester WLRM 5.45 5.1-6.0 .2046, 5 Remington 9 1/2 LRM 5.09 3.5-6.75 .6641, 6 Winchester WLR 4.8 There's not a lot of variance in primer burn rate, only in quantity of powder to burn per primer. 5.0 out of 5 star rating (5) Sometimes I hand seat with a Sinclair tool and sometimes I seat using the press. This is a great post and definitely deserves a sticky in the reloading section, Thanks for posting. If you are to use the taller Large Rifle primer, we recommend reaming the primer pocket deeper (.125"-.132"). Those extra heavy tended to be stronger, and light were weaker. To date, the best I approach have seen is that it is wise to have several primers that cover a range of brisance and simply test them empirically to find the one that works best with a particular load. Powered by UBB.threads PHP Forum Software 7.7.5. This has been noted by some sharps shooters when they break a firing pin. Closed the bolt and off she went.